Poligamia 411

Wa Alaikum Como Salaam, Amina

Maybe that was what it was with Alex too, a crude way of expressing the base emotion, jealously. Thanks for sharing. You validated my reaction. Men are so very different than women. They can be so insensitive at times.

Esta es una casa abierta. No hay necesidad de tocar. Sólo ven en.

What would Alex hope to achieve by asking Carolinah to take the oath is she’s just a nominal Muslim? Would she care about its implications?
I realise that’s not the point of your post, Me preguntaba.

Bek, I share your sentiments exactly. I can’t see how Carolinah would care about the implications or significance taking an oath like that would mean. Only someone that fears God would care about invoking God’s wrath upon himself/herself. I wouldn’t even ask someone to invoke the curse of God upon himself/herself, as it’s just far too serious a thing for someone to do whether the person is truthful or not. The thought of doing it gives me chills.

I personally know of a woman that took that oath. She had just gotten married and she and her husband contracted a Sexually Transmitted Disease. They both blamed each other for having contracted it and for tansmitting it. Taking that oath is just way toooooo scary for me.

I didn’t attempt to explain to Alex that whether Carolinah took the oath or not it would be no indication of any truth coming from her. I just confirmed how it’s done. I advised him to the best of my knowledge I wouldn’t take the oath, nor ask anyone to do it, and moved on in conversation.

Esta es una casa abierta. No hay necesidad de tocar. Sólo ven en.

It’s so sad when men decide to engage in polygamy and don’t concern themselves with the type of women that they introduce to the union, jeopardising the health and well being of those whom they are already married to, those striving to be pious, modest, devout and God fearing.

Esta es una casa abierta. No hay necesidad de tocar. Sólo ven en.

Judith, your comment was very kind, well taken, and extremely helpful…with that said, stay tune for a new beginning.

Esta es una casa abierta. No hay necesidad de tocar. Sólo ven en.

Your comment about contracting an STD really frightened me Ana! Even if we assume the best and Carolinah has been faithful to Alex I’m guessing he hasn’t been her only partner in the past. There are quite a few STDs that can be spread even if ‘protection’ is used. (I’m not sure what Islam teaches about ‘safe sex’- I hope I haven’t caused offense)
I hope you have found a way to guard your own health. Alex may have a right to polygamy but if one person has an STD it endangers the health of all of you.
I realize I must sound like I’m in total flap but until you wrote your comment I had never really thought about the implications polygamy could have on a person’s physical health.

Bek, I failed to mention before that you did not offend in anything you said, nor did it sound like you were “in total flap” LOL Your comment was much appreciated.

Esta es una casa abierta. No hay necesidad de tocar. Sólo ven en.

Wow, so no one sees the total irony in Alex suspiciously questioning you about YOUR whereabouts WHILE HE IS WITH ANOTHER WOMAN?? That really has got to be my “favorito” thing about polygamy, men are allowed other partners, while women are whores for even talking to other men. In some countries, women are actually murdered for this under the “law”. Maybe next time Alex calls you from the other woman’s house to question your behavior, you may remind him where he is, and ask him if he thinks he really has a right to ask.

Salaam To All,

Excellent stuff for debate. I will comment on this asap, because it is at the core of marriage, Islam, taqua and the Patriarchal order essential for peace and security.

waslaam,

dr omar

My Apologies,

I wrote the above post in haste (had to go pick up my wife)… and made several grammatical errors … but the sense of what is said is still accurate.

Thank you for posting Dear Ana.

Wasalaam,

dr omar

Dr.. Omar Zaid
Some background on me – I am a woman who has been in a monogamous marriage for over 30 años. For over a year, the study of polygamy has been an interesting academic hobby for me. I am not Muslim and admit to being very ignorant about your religion, although I have been trying to learn more about it to lessen my ignorance. I stumbled onto Ana’s blog shortly after she started it and have been following her journey ever since. I admire Ana and applaud how far she has come with her positive efforts to come to terms with her own life situation, while helping others at the same time.

I have a few questions for you from reading your comments. Because I believe that we all have things we can learn from others, I ask these questions with a respectful attitude in trying to understand and learn from you. (Please forgive my wording as I am not familiar with the correct Muslim terminology):

From several of your comments – It almost sounds like you are saying that Allah’s chosen form of marriage is polygamy and that men who are not living polygamy are not fulfilling their proper role as a man. Do you believe that polygamy is a higher form of marriage in the eyes of Allah?

Do you believe polygamy is an “option” which a man has the right to choose anytime and for any reason if he desires or is it something that is only a right under certain guidelines or conditions?

If a man chooses to live polygamy does that choice have a direct connection to eternal rewards? In other words does a man that lives polygamy gain more eternal rewards than one who chooses to only have one wife?

Do you think it is possible for a man to be happy and satisfied in a monogamous marriage?

If a man is happy in a monogamous marriage – do you think he is just suppressing his natural tendencies in order to do so?

Is it ever beneficial for a man to suppress his desire to live polygamy? If so, in what ways would it be beneficial? Sino, why not?

In many religions that practice polygamy, it seems there is an underlying belief that God favors men over woman. Do you believe that Allah favors men over women?

From my limited study of polygamy this past year, I have formed a conclusion that most women abhor the idea of polygamy and seem to be naturally predisposed to wanting a monogamous marriage. And yet you say that men are naturally predisposed to wanting more than one wife. Why is it that the woman is the one who has to adjust and not the man? If polygamy is helpful in turning a woman toward Allah in order to overcome her natural reaction, why is it that monogamy would not be just as helpful in directing the man toward Allah in order to overcome his natural tendencies?

In one of your comments you talked about how you prefer your 2nd wife as a bed mate and the 1st wife as a counselor? (I can’t find the comment again and I am not sure of the exact word you used) and that you had to help your 1st wife come to terms with your preference. How does this situation square with the Muslim rule of treating the wives equally? I have to admit when I read this comment my first reacton was Why did you let your wives know your preference and in so doing risk hurting them deeply? Was there a benefit to your wives in disclosing these preferences?

Since we all read things from the narrow view of our own experiences, it is easy to misinterpret what others write. I ask these questions in an effort to understand your comments and views better. I know you are a busy man and if you do not have time to respond to my many questions, Entiendo.
I have enjoyed reading and learning from you and look forward to learning more.

Respectfully,
CM

Salaam CM,

You have asked a string of very thoughtful questions, and will do my best to answer them. Each question is important and relate to the core of our love and respect for each other in light of Revelation.

I will attampt in a later post – or more likely posts – to deal with them one at a time.

Wasalaam,

dr omar

Do you believe polygamy is an “option” which a man has the right to choose anytime and for any reason if he desires or is it something that is only a right under certain guidelines or conditions?

Excellent question CM.

In short: “No I don’t and neither does Allah or the Prophets.” That’s why there are guidelines or “conditions.” I’m not going to go into the conditions here, except to say that religious idiots have made them points of concrete legalism, that by now have become tradition in many Muslim cultures, and hence have superceded Allah’s generous grace with opinions that are just as Catholic as the Pope.

Polygyny is an option that the man has and can take “whenever the conditions serve the Better interests of all involved.” Now here is the qualifier: ‘for all involved’. It may be that one of the involved (a disenchanted wife for example) takes her own option to leave should he choose another wife or lady whom she does not approve. As in all things, there is both good and evil or benefit and harm in the situation, and it is these matters that should be weighed in the minds of all involved.

Unfortunately, most folk just weigh the hormonal tides against the emotional objections, and justice is put off until the day of resurrection.

In the case of the wife who disapproves, one has to investigate the reasons why. If they are self-centered and lacking in compassion, the husband has every reason to over-ride her objections. If they are based on her intuition and subsequent evidence that the prospective wife represents a real and present and future danger – not just to her but also to her husband – then the husband must evaluate his choice in light of the “proven wife’s” objection.

Unfortunately, here again the Chauvinist male exercises the option without the restraint of wisdom, and wisdom is only made complete in marriage, which means that a wife’s opinion is invaluable, especially the more pious and intelligent she is.

Many Muslim men use the poor excuse of luckless fate and this is for two reasons. First they do not understand piety and second, they just want access to another woman’s charms irrespective of costs to those close to them. This is pure selfishness, prurience and immature. Sin embargo, just as a woman who marries an alcoholic is subjected to his dysfunction, so also are women who marry such men,,,, and there are many as you all know.

There are thousands of cases of supposedly mature Arab men and other Muslims consummating ‘holiday’ marriages in third world nations only to abandon the woman once their lust is satiated. They will all answer for this crime against God’s gift to them in the grave. They defile the woman by intention and then carry the grievous defilement home in their soul. Sub-human is too good a word for them.

Any man worth the salt Allah SWT placed in his veins and the blood that gives rise to his libido, must weigh the venture carefully when he desires a new wife. Desire is easily satisfied, but destiny has two paths, and it is the path of piety (benefit) he must therefore choose for his destiny to abide in righteousness forever. The men who say it was ‘fate made them marry’ are only half correct. There are two possible fates for everyone, and it is up to us to choose what is beneficial. Any other choice is sub-human and just plain foolishness. Here is the explanation:

“The choice that is meant in ikhtiyaar is the choice of what is good, better, or best between the two alternatives. This point is most important as it is aligned to the philosophical question of freedom. A choice of what is bad of two alternatives is therefore not a choice that can be called ikhtiyaar; in fact it is not a choice, rather it is an act of injustice done to oneself. Freedom is to act as one’s real and true nature demands—that is as one’s haqq [verdad] and one’s fitrah [original nature] demand—and so only the exercise of that choice which is of what is good can properly be called a “free choice.” A choice for the better is therefore an act of freedom, and it is also an act of justice done to oneself. It presupposes a knowledge of good and evil, of virtues and vices; whereas a choice for the worse is not a choice as it is grounded upon ignorance urged on by the instigation of the soul that inclines toward the blame-worthy aspects of the animal powers; it is then also not an exercise of freedom because freedom means precisely being free of domination by the powers of the soul that incites to evil.”

Syed Muhammad Naquib Al-Attas, Prolegomena to the Metaphysics of Islam: An Exposition of the Fundamental Worldview of Islam (Kaula Lumpur, Malaysia: ISTAC, 1995), p 33.

Just because Allah knows what a man will choose to do, does in no way indicate that the man’s will was fixed by Allah so that he had no choice. Men who say this are liars who excuse their sin and then try to compensate later by giving money or making good deeds. Such are no different than Catholics who believed they could sin and then buy indulgences. It’s all baloney!

Por lo tanto, the mature man will weigh the good and the bad, and will then inform those close to him of his choice and get their opinions or at least their acknowledgement.

A veces, a man has a wife who is ruled by her emotions and it is incumbent upon him to restrain her will by his own. In that event, he may be making the better choice to marry a more emotionally mature woman to set an example for her. There are many permutations of this and other circumstances.

The bottom line is “the man’s intention” … If it is for good and not just prurience, all will be well. If it is for the latter or for a misguided crusade (e.g. to save a prostitute), the price paid will equal the insult to both God’s law and good reason.

Wasalaam,
Dr omar

If a man is happy in a monogamous marriage – do you think he is just suppressing his natural tendencies in order to do so?

Dear Sister, without a properly designed survey, I cannot say scientifically the answer is “yes”. Sin embargo, based on my empirical experience, I can safely say that the majority of men I have discussed this with are suppressing their desire for an additional wife. Every one of my professional colleagues involved in a monogamous marriage has voiced their envy to me privately, but always add the caveat: “Don’t tell my wife!” Now this should speak for itself.

Of my non-professional associates and friends, this unofficial survey remains affirmative, and most often with the same caveat. I have met several men who are practicing polygamy successfully but the wives are in different households, which makes life more demanding for the husband. Todavía, these men have expressed satisfaction, and without exception are envious that I’ve managed to keep my wives under one roof.

Many men will resign themselves to one woman on the basis that a ‘bird in hand is worth two in the bush’, but the danger here lies in the unspoken desire and the unresolved conflict of interests, and this may lead to opportunities for extra-marital affairs; and there lay the danger with the satans patiently waiting.

One must also remember that unmarried women are actually attracted to married men just because they are successfully married; and especially to men of achievement and proven stability who age gracefully.

Sin embargo, the man is not necessarily unhappy if he suppresses his desire and remains “faithful” to the beloved wife who is unwilling to share and pretends he’s not interested in the prospect. Almost certainly he is, but most often, circumstances prevent his actualization and social taboos keep the topic off the kitchen table.

The danger here lay in the wife’s eventual loss of her charms as she ages or eats herself out of his desire. But I’ve discussed this elsewhere.

Wasalaam, dr omar

In many religions that practice polygamy, it seems there is an underlying belief that God favors men over woman. Do you believe that Allah favors men over women?

No, not at all. This sentiment is the refuse of Aryanism (Brahmanism). It is metaphysical misogyny with roots in Babylonian sexual magick and Tibetan Tantrism. These shamans reduced the feminine to a worthless non-being required only for their assimilation of her essence but not of her – often their rituals included her murder and dismemberment after sexual gratification. This is done to acquire the “perfected “ state of spiritual Hermaphrodism or androngyny needed for their Transcendence of the Physical world and astral Abyss in order to attain enlightenment and superior powers as wizards and sorcerers. Satan has them truly wired.

The doctrine has ‘trickled down’ the Pyramid to become the common concept of male dominance and Chauvinism, and even male superiority. Nothing could be further from the truth. En el Islam, men and women stand equal before God, but there is a level of a degree reserved for the man as Imam or Wali: the guardian and guide of his wife and family. In other words, someone has to be boss and Allah reserved this job for the man. It bears greater responsibility and also graver consequences.

I will now caution the Muslims as men and husbands and fathers. You are Imams, and if you lie to your wife and children as their leader, you will never even smell the scent of Paradise. Which means when Mohammad makes his intercession, those of you in hell will not be released on this account. If your lies have caused them to become people of the fire, they will be released while you remain. Think hard on this my brothers.

This then brings us to the woman’s submission to her husband. This is required as a trial for her as an example of submission to Allah by example. As long as the man is in submission to Allah, the wife is required to submit or come under Allah’s censure.

Trouble is, the community has enlarged this requirement to include men who do not submit, or to men who only pretend to submit to Allah’s revealed religion. Hence, women’s rights have been taken away almost entirely across the board, because even the judges are chauvinist and will not condemn their brothers out of self-condemnation. Observe an opinion from a greater scholar than I::

“Beginning within a few decades after the Prophet, and by the 11th Century, almost each and every principle established by the Qur’an and the Prophet—confirming the rights and status of women… had been to a greater or lesser extent negated.” — “By the early 20th Century, the ummah had been reconstituted as a series of nation-states based on the European models, not only in the political, but also in the legal, educational, economic and other spheres … placed in the hands of secular oriented elements… nurtured by the former colonial powers… A disjuncture exists between theory and practice that dominates the political process… the overall condition of democracy and human rights in the Muslim world in general, and especially at the official and government levels of its Arab core is truly dismal.”
Prof. Muddhatir’Abd AlRahim,
The Human Rights Tradition in Islam
Praeger, 2005 p. 70, 114

So then … what’s the verdict? Islam and the World are in crisis as a result of men’s failure to obey the tenants of their religion. It’s a simple as that. Prophet Isaiah said that women and children will come to rule over men in the latter days as a result, and this is happening globally because men are failing in their role as shepherd. Only this is not agood thing either because the wrong kind of women are rising to the top. The man’s role as huband and father requires them not only to be protectors and providers, but also teacher of true religion. Many many many are teaching false religion, and a hundred times more are teaching no religion. It’s a real pitiful situation.

Así que … hence I gave Ana her counsel to stand up for truth and be caounted as her husband’s equal in the eyes of God. Alhamduillah!

Wasalaam dr omar

THE LAST OF CM’S QUESTIONS:

In one of your comments you talked about how you prefer your 2nd wife as a bed mate and the 1st wife as a counselor? (I can’t find the comment again and I am not sure of the exact word you used) and that you had to help your 1st wife come to terms with your preference. How does this situation square with the Muslim rule of treating the wives equally? I have to admit when I read this comment my first reacton was Why did you let your wives know your preference and in so doing risk hurting them deeply? Was there a benefit to your wives in disclosing these preferences?

This preference that a man has for one of his wives is at the core of the statement in Al’Qur’an ‘that no man can treat his wives equally’. Ahora … in my situation, one wife is a perfect playmate, and the other a perfect advisor or consort. I have preferences for each wife. One is more sensually appealing, and the other more intellectually appealing. There is a balance here and each wife understands her place in my life as a necessary companion. If I were to base my relationship solely on sexuality, there is no comparison that equates the two women.

If I could combine them into one wife, then I could say it is possible I might be satisfied completely with an imaginary creature that does not exist in my life. And here is the crux of the matter. I need both qualities, and each of them needs a husband who will love and respect them for what they have to offer him.

I counseled both regarding the situation, as it is crucial that a woman knows why she is needed by the husband and why he chose her.

Sí, the less desirable wife was devastated when I told her, but she quickly recovered and accepted the reality. ¿Por qué? Because she loves me and loves Allah more than me … and she appreciates the many blessings Allah brought into her life as a result of our marriage, and counted this deficit as negligible when placed on the scale. It also caused her to look again in the mirror and assess her own attributes. And when she realized the significance of her role in my life as a spiritual barometer, she accounted it superior to sensuality, which it is. This reality orientation, coupled with my steadfast attention to her needs and my use of her own powers of cognition (on a continuum), more than compensate for the one area in which she is unable to satisfy me.

Like men, women fear rejection when in love, and such fears must be dealt with in order to mature and accept reality => verdad. People want and desire an ideal, but this is not an ideal world … that is yet to come. Hence, the path to peace is acceptance of those things we cannot change, and gratitude for whatever provisions God has given us. This is wisdom. She is a wise woman.

For the second wife, the opposite is true. She is not my closest confidant in matters of import, but this limitation does in no way deter her from enjoying to the full our marriage and accepting it for what it is. Actually, she is relieved of that burden and this sets her free to spend her time and effort on other matters of importance to her. Each wife has accepted their place because I have defined each woman’s significance and importance to me. Hence, they are complementary, and bear no grudge, one towards the other, because of their understanding and because I treat them equally in all other matters. A consecuencia, they find a companionship in each other that is the envy of many sisterly ‘best friends’ because they are joined to and love the same man, and thus share an intimacy others cannot know.

Like ministers of state, each lady has her portfolio in my little kingdom and each lady is assured daily of their tenure. If I am with one and the other is away with relatives or home alone, the absent wife is either phoned or contacted via internet 2 - 3 times a day, and all three of us contantly acknowledge each other with genuine concerns for ech other’s well being. This communication and inclusion is the glue that binds us together, and truth is the medium or channel of light that carries each message straight to the heart, so that neither lady feels “shut out.” Now there are even times when they prefer each other’s company to mine own, and that is much to my satisfaction as well.

Así que … dear lady CM, I took the risk of “hurting them” for the benefits of truth or ‘reality orientation’ that carries greater blessings once people comprehend their destiny and purpose and then accept it. The trouble we humans have is with interlopers (religiosos, social and political reformers) who constantly interfere with their diminuative imaginations and wish “us” to join them in valleys of illusion and denial of truth orientation. God is truth, and wherever we find truth we find the messages of His existence and Mercy and His additional grace once we acknowledge the discernment and accept it as His truth and not one of our own making; the latter being the platform for Secular Humanism which is destroying the world and sending umpteen millions to hell.

Por lo tanto, my advice for wives who are less appealing to their husbands sensually is to simply accept it and get over it, because God has something else in mind for their eternal blessing or perhaps is trying to teach them something.

“There is a thing you do not like, but Allah means it for your good.”

This brings us to the end of these 10 significant questions. I hope my responses are of some value to the readers of this site.

May Allah forgive any error(con) I may have made. I am just a man, subject to error like all others.

Wasalaam, dr omar

CM,

No problem whatsoever. Dr.. Omar is welcomed here and is a huge asset to us all. I want the blog to continue to be informative and helpful not only for myself, but others. I join Judith in thanking you for your courage to pose questions to Dr. Omar so we all could benefit.

Dr Omar has helped take the blog to another level with his expertise and again I thank him. Of course I will continue to tell Alex and my story and share information about polygamy in the world as it’s revealed to me. I hope all will continue to visit and participate here at polygamy 411, as we go forward into a new year. Thank you CM for being a sincere, supportive, good friend!

Esta es una casa abierta. No hay necesidad de tocar. Sólo ven en.

Asalaam Walikum
I converted to Islam 6 months ago after a dream from Allah. Two months ago I was asked to consider marriage as a second wife. We married two weeks ago.

I am very devoted in living my life for Allah, and prayed and spent hours questioning if this was a role I could accept. I knew if it was Allahs will, it would happen and it did.

My comment is about second wives and the feelings emotionally that come with not being first wife. I didnt have a big reception, no honeymoon , we have not even spent a night together yet for several reasons, mainly I found out after the marriage that my husband cannot afford to support me for a few months still and he is leaving for work for several months. Thank God I have a good career and want to continue to work! Does it bother me? Sure it does, but i pray and try to not think about what i did not get being second wife. I focus on Gods Will and pray for strength and patience and courage to continue to serve God and be as good a wife as I can be. Before any thinks this was a haram marriage, it was not…we marrying in a proper nikah at the mosque with three witnesses and the Imam was my wali.

I have not met the first wife…insha’Allah, one day I would like to and pray that we can be freinds, or at least coexist peacefully. I think about how she feels about this marraige, and it drives me crazy… I really try not to think about it. Before anyone says I should have thought about this before agreeing to marriage. I did , a lot!

I enjoy reading your posting Ana..thank you for sharing such intimate insight into your life and feelings.

Kelly, Wa Alaikum Como Salaam,

Bienvenido a la poligamia 411. Thank you for sharing with us and commenting. You’ve been through so much in such a short period of time, accepting Islam six months ago, meeting your husband two months ago and marrying him two weeks ago. It sound like a whirlwind of emotions and activity.

You probably never envisioned your life being this way. Por supuesto, no one knows EXACTLY what they’re getting into until they’re in it. How would you know exactly what you’d feel until you began living polygamy. Now that you’re living it and what you’re feeling is real – what do you do now? I think what you’re feeling and thinking is inevitable. I think you have a good mindset as to what you’re going to do. Based on what you’re saying, you want to put Allah first and deal with what he has decreed for you at this time. Correct me if I’m wrong.

I’m sure there are some people that would tell you to bail out, as you were deceived and didn’t know the truth. That’s an option too. I can’t very well suggest you do that, as I was in the same boat as you. I married Alex with the understanding he knew little about Islam, but was willing to learn and he wanted me to help him. After marrying him, I realized he knew absolutely nothing about Islam and had no strong desire to know. I didn’t tell him to get to steppin and divorce him.

Life as you know isn’t easy. All types of obstacles get in our way of living the life we dreamed of. Sounds to me that you’ve decided to put your faith and trust in Allah and make the best out of what you’ve been presented with. It’s a blessing you have your own income and can support yourself, which helps you to have patience with the situation. Patience is so important. I pray for much, much more of it.

Me preguntaba – does he not spend the night with you because his first wife has no knowledge of you? At least him being gone for several months to seek work will give you time to digest what’s been going on and give you time to grow nearer to Allah for guidance.

I’m hoping some more wives come forward and speak to you about how they cope with the feelings that you described and let you know if they have had or have similar feelings. It would be greatly appreciated.

Hang in there and don’t despair.

Esta es una casa abierta. No hay necesidad de tocar. Sólo ven en.

Wa’alaikumsalam anna,

Bueno, I think I made mistake. The wife of the prophet ibrahim who is also second wife is siti hajar, I wrong in mention name … lol

Pardon me …,

Take care all of you,